Oh... The Madness

There exists among us a group that believes that Islam is inherently violent. The mere practice of the faith is a precursor to violence. Any rational person would come to the conclusion that there is no text that would provoke violence unless without an individual having a propensity for violence. They justify this belief by quoting passages from the Koran.

It would also seem logically that when you read the Koran you would take into the account the historical and cultural context at the time the text was written. For example, In Leviticus 20, the phrase put to death is found 9 times. However, as Christians, we interpret this to mean that the “wages of sin is death” which means a spiritual death and a separation from God.

Leviticus 12 says that a woman that births a male child is unclean for six days but when a woman births a female child she is unclean for 12 days. How would you interpret that?

The following is the text from the Koran. In bold is the passage that was quoted as proof to Islam’s doctrine for violence.

[8.9] When you sought aid from your Lord, so He answered you: I will assist you with a thousand of the angels following one another.
[8.10] And Allah only gave it as a good news and that your hearts might be at ease thereby; and victory is only from Allah; surely Allah is Mighty, Wise.
[8.11] When He caused calm to fall on you as a security from Him and sent down upon you water from the cloud that He might thereby purify you, and take away from you the uncleanness of the Shaitan, and that He might fortify your hearts and steady (your) footsteps thereby.
[8.12] When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.
[8.13] This is because they acted adversely to Allah and His Apostle; and whoever acts adversely to Allah and His Apostle-- then surely Allah is severe in requiting (evil).
[8.14] This-- taste it, and (know) that for the unbelievers is the chastisement of fire.
[8.15] O you who believe! when you meet those who disbelieve marching for war, then turn not your backs to them.
[8.16] And whoever shall turn his back to them on that day-- unless he turn aside for the sake of fighting or withdraws to a company-- then he, indeed, becomes deserving of Allah's wrath, and his abode is hell; and an evil destination shall it be.

We know in the bible that God called the Israelites to war for His purpose. But in this same chapter of the Koran it goes on to say:

[8.60] And prepare against them what force you can and horses tied at the frontier, to frighten thereby the enemy of Allah and your enemy and others besides them, whom you do not know (but) Allah knows them; and whatever thing you will spend in Allah's way, it will be paid back to you fully and you shall not be dealt with unjustly.
[8.61] And if they incline to peace, then incline to it and trust in Allah; surely He is the Hearing, the Knowing.
[8.62] And if they intend to deceive you-- then surely Allah is sufficient for you; He it is Who strengthened you with His help and with the believers

You will note in 8.12 the believer is given the authority to strike his enemy and in 8.13 they are given the reason. But go down to 8.61 they are told that if the non-believer seeks peace, then they are to make peace. And if that peace is made for reason of deception, then their faith is sufficient to protect them. The odd thing about them using this passage is that I could post one from the bible with the exact same context.

I’ve really grown tired of this “Islam is the enemy” crap spewing from the right. The increased radicalization of their rhetoric should be a cause for concern. So far, they seem content with spewing their hatred on the Internet from the comforts of home. But you can believe that an even more radicalized undercurrent exists and it will eventually manifest itself in violence.

We’ll then see if they will condemn violence against innocent Muslims – that of course, if there is such a thing as an innocent Muslim.

1. Why the madness?


12 Responses to Oh... The Madness

  1. stuffle Says:
    Saying that the right is saying "Islam is the enemy" is greatly over-simplifying what the leaders on the right are saying. If you listen to what GWB says in his speaches, for example, you will hear that he is very careful to point out that it is the "Islamists" that are the problem. It is the people twisting the Muslim religion for their own purposes that are the problem, etc. Some right wing bloggers may be guilty of such blanket statements, but the right wing leaders are usually far more specific in pointing out that it is the radical islamist that are the problem and not islam as a whole.

    Of course, if you look at how the leaders in the Islam world reacted to the Popes latest statements, some of them even going as far as to call for his death (thus actually proving what the Pope said to be true), the Muslim leaders are not really doing anything to help their own cause.
  2. James Manning Says:
    That's true. I just want folks to narrow their rhetoric.
  3. Rashid Muhammad Says:
    The right wing leaders are being careful because they are politicians. The right wing pundits spill a lot more ink and have a lot more exposure and are not nearly as measured.

    I used to have these arguments defending Islam but I got tired. I found that most people who acted like they were earnest didn't really want to learn about Islam, they just wanted somebody to take to church or to name call since it's so fashionable these days. Those who are sincere I'll talk to, but they are rare.
  4. Little Miss Chatterbox Says:
    Ditto Stuffle's comments!!
  5. bold as love Says:
    Here's a prediction: At some point and time in the near future-say 3-10 years, this argument concerning Islam will no longer be necessary- It will be pretty fuckin' obvious what Islam is and has always been, a idealogy that will not rest until everyone is dead or converted. I gues this is more "right wing rhetoric", but I ask all of you- have you really took a historical look at Islam?
    Dismiss my opinions and others if you want to, but first gather alot of historical sources concerning Islam, then make a decision- Hey, if you still will not or can not see the peril the world faces, that's on you.
  6. The Best [ Ghostface ] Says:
    Hey Jay (James)


    Chance: Islam is about 500 years behind Christianity remember Islam can about 1, 400 and something or 1, 500 years after Christianity and so if you look at Christianity 500 years ago (1300 to 1900 centuries) Christians were just as violent as Muslims and white Europeans Christians conquered the world and declared all the non-Christians they conquered to be heathens with pagan religions. Christians killed, executed (Spanish inquisition in Spain), burned to the stake those they thought were witches etc, punished those who did not follow certain Christian’s percepts in the community, started wars in the name of religion etc just like Muslims do a lot of to day. Muslims are just 500 years behind Christians. And some day they will become just as civilized as white Europe and other countries were whites make up the majority in politics numerically. Many non-white Christians countries are just as miserable and war tore and no democracy as Muslim countries. So I say it has more to do with the collective moral disposition of people than it has to do with what religion they belong to.

    By Chance
  7. mark Says:
    chance: Christians killed, executed (Spanish inquisition in Spain), burned to the stake those they thought were witches etc, punished those who did not follow certain Christian’s percepts in the community, started wars in the name of religion etc just like Muslims do a lot of to day. Muslims are just 500 years behind Christians.

    mb: Yo chance I made this exact point to some Zealots and fanaticts who were dogging Islam. Rashid is correct people are not interested in learning they only what to throw prejudice rhetorical bombs at each other.

    James have you noticed that the same narrowness "christians" accused Islam of having they display all too often themselves.

    Bold you are closeminded individual who is not seeking truth. Your view is deeply based in your religious beliefs which says all non christians are going to hell. That is the real problem the intellectual intolerance of most religions.

    Just one more reason why I despise all religions.
  8. James Manning Says:
    I think Chance has hit it on the head. We actually blogged about this and compared Mexico and Islam.
  9. Little Miss Chatterbox Says:
    How do you feel knowing the Dictator of Venezuela agrees with you that Bush is the devil? I would think that might make you a little uneasy.
  10. James Manning Says:

    Chavez is an idiot - I just happen to be an "almost" comedic genius. I'm more uneasy with the fact that the fool controls so much oil. I'm also not fond that he is taking my material and not paying me royalties.
  11. The Best [ Ghostface ] Says:
    To mark

    I feel you on that one Mark and Rashid, that is correct some people are just debating not because they want to find solutions but to find a reason to argue and criticize Islam.

    By Chance
  12. The Best [ Ghostface ] Says:
    Hey Jay,

    Yes like you said Jay (james) there is nothing like hitting the nail on the head with a good point of view.

    By Chance